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I'm just glad hospice is there if I need them, Veronica. The companies have been friends to many caregivers.

I wrote something on this thread a while back, so it keeps coming up on my newsfeed. There is a lot of guilt that goes with the death of a loved one at times. It is easier for some people to deal with guilt by turning it into blame. We weren't there when the LO was passing, so we don't know things for sure. I just hope the people can find peace.
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I searched for this topic. And i fully understand. My father had prostate cancer and he was up and down w his health. Could no longer walk but he still could smile, talk, move and taught me how to shave him. Was embarrassed that i had to help clean him, see him naked and put on his condom catheter. My mother could no longer see herpartner of 48 years, like this so, she decided (she is a retired USAF Lt. R.N. and ER Psych R.N.) to admit him into the VA hospice (dad was Ret. USAA Sgt. Maj.). He went into hospice in his wheel chair doing fair, 2 days later he was comotose. I thought that was odd. He had the inflatable bed and they kept him lying down on his back. He could barely speak. I remember being very irate w the nurses when they chsnge his bed from.a comfy inflatable mattress to a stiff hard one. They ignored my rants. He died 2 weeks after mom admitted him. I have death anxiety. Its been 3 years and i can barely sleep at night because i believe hospice placed my dad in that comotose state and dehydrated him to death. I did not go see his body in the morgue because that site would have made me suicidal. I actually wake up gasping for air when im sleep and my throat gets dry thinking...God that's probably how dad felt. Its a struggle. For those whose comments are about blame....calm down...we have a right to post how we feel..without critcism. Keep it cool.
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How I describe a Hospice: is a garbage can full of murder, where the doctors throw all these elderly.

My father's primary doctor, send hospice to my house on 02/28/2016. He stated that he have severe dementia, hospice nurse was pushing me to medicate my father with out having pain. I notice the she wants me to kill my father with those medications, my father started having a FOLICULITIS infection the nurse told me that they would not treat that, she said let him die, he is not have quality life. Hospice said to me don't call 911 don't take to the hospital. I took him to the hospital anyway and the doctor drained the DI skin obsess, give antibiotic and my father is recovering. I pray to God for guiding me and I found out the hospice is the trash can. Hospice selected few patient to cover the murders. They call graduated from hospice, that is a lie. If I listen this killer nurse, my father would be dead. I called the insurance to asks if is any cover limit for my father they told me no, I said that I am not satisfied with hospice that I would like to have another opinion. I took him to a doctor on May 11/2016 to help me to discontinue VNA & HOSPICE. My father is home safe. We don' have be silence about the way hospice terminate people's life.
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We can not deny that hospice medication method cut people's life, with all these opoids medication morphine, lorazepam, haloperidol, bisac-eva, cp prochlorper, cp hyocyam.
The murderers can not see cruelty because they see normal method of ending life, but no one can know or predict the time of anyone's life . how can they says their give comfort with all these narcotic. Just remember no body can take anybody's life, what goes around comes around.
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My mom died a week ago. She had some dementia, but her body had been so debilitated by rheumatoid arthritis that she was a complete cripple in every joint even with multiple replacements over the years. she was at a wonderful assisted living site where they loved her like family. two weeks go, the clots in her leg (ruined vascular system also caused by her disease) and she was in terrible pain, moaning and writhing. She was already on hospice, because of her many problems with clots and all her other problems. the pain was terrible and I had stopped in to give her lunch but instead took her to ER so the pain could be managed quicker. we ended up in a larger hospital, thinking s vascular surgeon could perhaps help. she was, of course, not a candidate, even for amputation. At this point they had started to get her some relief, and she was more herself than in a long time. We had to speak plainly, that there was nothing to be done, and she agreed to place herself in God's hands. She struggled with terrible pain for two days, until hey were able to get ahead of it, and she was discharged with palliative care back to her assisted living. after that, she was pretty out of it, and my siblings, except for one, did not really see what she went through, but they got it, and all were supportive of her meds. we are grateful that she was at least somewhat aware of us all and her friends.

But it is hard, because she is gone. She hadn't been much of my mom for a couple of years, because of the dementia.

I've been mostly OK, because we did the best we could. But now I am having nightmares of her in agony, and when I wake up, she is still dead and I couldn't save her.
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Barb, So sorry your Mom is gone. My condolences to you and your family.

Someone will be along shortly who can help you with the nightmares.
I will be thinking of you.
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I doubt send had the spellcaster guy in mind....Barb, I'm so sorry for your loss.

It sounds as though you did EVERYTHING right; you saw that there was no way around your mom's intractable pain and life-limiting diagnoses. You got her relief.

You could not 'save' her because death is ultimately part of life that we don't control. But you got her help with the pain.
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We can not deny that hospice medication method cut people's life, with all these opoids medication morphine, lorazepam, haloperidol, bisac-eva, cp prochlorper, cp hyocyam. The murderers can not see cruelty because they see normal method of ending life, but no one can know or predict the time of anyone's life . how can they says their give comfort with all these narcotic. Just remember no body can take anybody's life, what goes around comes around.
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The drugs gave comfort to Barb's mom who was in pain for years. It's horrible to see someone in constant pain and not be able to help them. Barb, my condolences. Logically, you know you did your best for her. Subconsciously, you feel so guilty for not doing more. Caregiver's Guilt. Most people go through this. I'm glad that your mom found peace from the constant debilitating pain in the end. You did great for her. I agree that you need to speak to someone because of the nightmares. {{hugs}}
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One should not view life in black and white. There are grays. To have a very strong stand against hospice and to call them murderers is a very, very narrow view. To go on and on publicly trying to persuade others that you will be murdering a family member if they go into hospice service is wrong. Not only are you condemning the nurses, but you're also adding more burden to the caregiver who has done their best. Like I said before, I wished we were able to get hospice service for mom who was in pain at the end.

You're right. What goes around comes around. Be very careful with what you wish for.
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Barb you did absolutely the very best for your Mom and made compassionate choices for her to help relieve the pain. Most drugs can have side effects and narcotics are not exempt but think of the greater good of relieving a loved ones suffering. Condolences for your loss, don't second guess your decisions. Nothing can be changed now and Mom had the relief of being able to die with less pain. Did it shorten her life? It could have done because being in severe pain frequently keeps people from being able to relax and let nature take it's course. Being comfortable allows the body to relax and take the next step.

There a are stages to dying just as there are stages to birth. For some reason we know more about the joyous event of giving birth whereas death remains more of a mystery. I believe some cultures know far more about it than we in the Western world do.
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I am convinced they intentionally gave my mother overdose of morphine and lorazipam.. she had strong heart and vitals signs, just major pain her back and was in kind of a dementia due to the pain. she kept saying i cant i cant, one day a nurse came and asked me for the morphine ,and asked me to leave. the next morning mom was dead !! i believe she overdosed mom on that damn morphine !!
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She kill your mom, The murderers can not see cruelty because they see normal method of ending life. If I Say anything on this blog about hospice or killer nurses it is base on my experience. We should not put our loved ones in hospice care they are silent murderer. I promise to my father that I will take care, protect, defend him from all these murderer.
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Hi rambo444, I believe that the same thing happened to my Dad. The night before he died all his vital signs were good and his heart was very strong. Hospice doctor was there and was surprised that he showed good color and his temperature was fine. He acted surprised. Went out to nurse and whispered something to her. I watched them talk and was uncomfortable with what I saw. Mom and I left Dad late that night and by early morning they called us to tell us that Dad had passed. Think that they overdosed him with morphine right after we left. I am so lost with what is going on now medically with my Mom (91) and my husband being sick. Prayers to all on this site.
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Yes! Hospice told me that my father had to leave...one way, or another by Thursday. He was alert, talkative, could see, hear, think & talk about philosophical things, feed himself, etc...on Sunday afternoon and by Thursday early morning he was dead. Death certificate read Pneumonia. Hospice continued to give him morphine & Ativan...for the pain, which he didn't have. He always looked ten years young than his true age. The undertaker said that his was the worse body he had ever seen...due to the drugs. Since then, I have heard several cases from friends & their friends about Hospice...all negative.
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I wouldn't leave my father's side & listened to any discussion between the medical staff...those of whom who spoke near me. At one point the doctor came in & told the nurse to give him an injection. I rose & walked over to the doctor & said to her, "You can't do that, his blood pressure is too low, the injection will kill him!" She was so surprised that I said this...that all she could do was give me a shocked look...& then she said, "Oh, I forgot." What type of response is this from a doctor? "Oh, I forgot." After two days & nights of staying by his side, they got me out of the room for a couple of hours...he died during this time.
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How old was your Dad EvaMaria? Was the injection they wanted to give him Morphine? What was the disease which they said that he would be dead in 6 months?
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I hesitate to comment on this thread again. But it worries me that people coming to the forum for support at a time when they or their loved ones are approaching death will leave it convinced that hospice is nothing more than some kind of licensed execution programme. Their relationship with the professionals they need to rely on will be in tatters before it's even begun; but that relationship is absolutely critical to getting through the death of a loved one with as little trauma as possible.

Three types of drug are commonly in use at the end stages of life.

Morphine is used to relieve severe pain (for example, in cancer), but it is also used to improve the quality of respiration (for example, in heart failure). The way this works can seem counterintuitive to the layman - it certainly did to me - but if you want to understand it, ask. Essentially it eases the breathing mechanism, reducing the heart's workload, and it also improves blood flow. It is NOT given to cause breathing to cease.

Hyoscine represses secretions. The purpose of giving it is to prevent patients' experiencing the terrifying sensation of drowning as their lungs fail. It causes drowsiness. I don't know, I haven't tried either, but I would guess that being too drowsy to talk to your children is probably preferable to nature's equivalent of waterboarding.

Sedatives are given to relieve the patient's anxiety and distress. The dying process can be terrifying; and the key point if that these drugs prevent *the patient* from enduring that terror. Of course it is hard for relatives not to feel that it is their own feelings that are being spared - that their loved ones are being doped to the eyeballs so that we won't have to watch their agony, or keep a prolonged vigil. But if it's hard to watch, just imagine what it's like to go through.

The key word, too, is *prevent*. Why was your loved one given these drugs when they weren't experiencing noticeable symptoms? Because, believe me, you didn't want those symptoms to become noticeable. You can't prevent something once it's already happened.

We tend to prefer natural processes such as birth, growth and death to take place naturally; but Nature is not always our friend. Medicine, from its beginnings, has developed as mankind's way of trying to protect ourselves against Nature's nastier, crueller moments.

Medicine is not perfect, not even close. But it is carried out by people who are doing their best to give their patients the best outcome possible in the circumstances. Some of those people will be better than others, just as some people in any walk of life are better than others. More patient, kinder, gentler, more perceptive, more empathetic, more intelligent, better at communicating... Which, unfortunately, means that some will be less so; and you will have to meet them half way by asking questions, expressing preferences and raising concerns.

If you really feel that one or more people on your hospice team are working to a schedule, or have become so hardened to death they have lost sight of their patients' humanity, or for some other reason are just definitely in the wrong job, then speak up, call another service provider, call your own doctor or your loved one's doctor for advice.

Remind the hospice team, if necessary, that this may be all in a day's work to them, but that for your loved one and your family and you it is a unique time that they need to stay sensitive to. If you have questions, they shouldn't be dismissed. If you want to know why a particular thing is being done, you have a right to ask and a right to expect a clear explanation.

But the best hospice professionals in the world can't prevent death from being a time of loss and grief. Your loved one, who was walking and talking and laughing, will be gone. Their role is to make that passing as peaceful and free of pain and fear as possible for their patient, but they can't save you from losing your loved one. Be fair in what you expect of them.
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Churchmouse, Well said.
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I think a few posters on here have another agenda, by that I mean the one hit posters
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Thank you for that insightful post CM. It would be nice it made a difference to the haters and troublemaker but as Kellse said they have another agenda.
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This thread is becoming very negative and vindictive. I've actually 'stopped ' following here....except CM's comment popped up on my newsfeed and hooked me back in. I don't want to see this thread popping up in my newsfeed. Every time I read such angry anti comments, I worry about other caregivers who currently have a family member close to the end. You can't reason with haters. They are right and everyone else who doesn't agree with their views are wrong.... Be very careful that karma doesn't bite you from behind.....
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Bookluver and others: Anyone can 'report this post' or contact the AC Administration to delete anything you find offensive or hurtful.

Or, the caregivers as a group can drown out the haters:
1) Stop posting to them, opposing them, just ignore them.
2) Drown them out with multiple positive experiences, again not mentioning how you disagree-but instead-keep on topic, post positive, supportive, and uplifting comments.
3) If a topic is fraught with controversy, ignore it-don't fight over it. Just not worth it to try to reason with or persuade those with opposing views.

Moving to my favorite things...
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Why to ask about age every body have right to live. Doctors engage to hospice service for their elderly patients, wrongful predicted the time of life of our love ones. My father was predicted on 2014 to live 6 month, again this year predicted for 6 months. If I let the killer nurse to medicate my father he will be dead in less then two weeks with all the opioids that are using to end elderly's life
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I hope when my final days come, that someone is there to allow Hospice to come in to be an extra set of ears and eyes to my comfort. The Hospice group was wonderful and caring to my Mom in her final weeks.
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my mother was put on hospice over yr ago. She was given same meds completely imobilizing her. POA (brother) took her off them and she came back as.clear as before. I had disagreed with hospice care also bcause of past problems surrounding this situation with several others. They refused PT said shewas bedridden and became fixed in prone position. She didnt pass one year recertification. She is off hospice but now we face a bedridden mom(they blamed side affect from meds & alzheimers) & i feel due to poor care on hospice part) She cant sit up , PT is finally working with her. What a waste of a year in bed and the frustration she has had and is going thru. We are Very anti-hospice. We cant get her in a wheelchair yet to go to Dr. but thankfully palliative care is coming....to home.. UGH!!!
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Hospice was a blessing when my father was passing.. He was pain free and they were a huge source of help to me with final creamation recomendations
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NO ONE has the right to shorten someone life!!!!! This is call murder. I have seen what hospice was doing to my husband. I stopped all of hospice drugs in time to save my husband then together we dismissed hospice . My husband is now out of bed, he is walking, talking, eating, and is enjoying his TV shows.
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One thing I have noticed is that there is a lot of new posters that signed up just to write on this thread alone, with negative remarks. Strange how they sought out this very thread as this thread usually disappears for weeks on end.

Then all the sudden a rash of new posters who never wrote on the forums before, never asked questions or answered other posters who had questions elsewhere on the forums. It's very easy to trace. Shame if you are using multi-monikers.

Not saying this the case for every poster as there are posters who have been on the forums for awhile who lost a loved one and felt something wasn't quite right. Their feelings are legit, such as the original poster Rosie.
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Day by day many of us open our eyes to know how bad the hospice is. Some people probably support the hospice not because it is good. When I read some posts, I believe that they are employees of the hospice. Posts about all the murders in the hospice. We can share our experience that we had with our loved ones.
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