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cmag this is a good thread it has helped me very much with dealing with Mom-now I can approch her as a stronger person and now know I was not just a bad child as she wanted me to believe and finally got my power back that I had given to her all those years ago-and the power she had to hurt me-I can ignor. A little late in life but still important nonethe less-I thank you for talking about this subject and educating others about this personality-she is not going to change at 93 but she will not hurt me any longer.
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Good morning. I'm glad to see this thread continues to be alive and well with support and encouragement for each other. Prayers, hugs, and love for all as each faces their individual trials in this another week of living!
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Good Morning Everyone!
It's been a few weeks since I've been in touch but know that you're in my prayers daily. I am so grateful for this site.
May God continue to give us strength to face each day.
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Actually I am with it but it came out wrong that I am not supportive. I definitely am supportive. Please just disregard that earlier statement. Best Wishes and Good night everyone.
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What I meant was I am very supportive of everyone here, but I just don't post that b/c I am not completely with it. But yes, I am supportive of you guys. I just didn't word it right. You'd think I could word it correctly, since I am a wordsmith. It just didn't come out right. My apologies. I really like this site and everyone on it has my best regards.
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Brandywine1949:

I'm rather curious about your statement, "I am not supportive of you guys."
Would you care to elaborate about this?
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Emjo: Thanks for the definition of a "codependent." It certainly rings true in our family.
I called my sister to see how our mom w/ALZ-91 yrs. old is doing. It's just now up on 2 mos. that her 93 yr. old sister died, w/whom mother and sister lived. My mom was a narcissist while my sister and me were growing up. So emotionally we were quite neglected. Yes, there were the roles put into place early on. But at some point, I've decided for myself, that I didn't want to continue doing the codependent thing, or at least I try my best not to. So when I asked my sister the other day, how our mom was given the recent loss of her sister, sister tells me something like, "Well mom has gone back to the sleeping all of the time bit, tuning out." My mom way before the ALZ always new how to tune out, when she should have been majorly tuning in. So my sister and me feel a bit as if this is some very old behavior on her part, now given ALZ, and age, well what can one expect? Anyway, I could hear it in my sister's voice, the frustration, and I guess she's still somehow dreaming that our mom is going to miraculously step up to the plate and provide her with some kind of warm and fuzzy behavior, and bond w/her. By contrast, I gave up that thought a long time ago. So I just told my sister that under current circumstances we cannot really expect much out of my mom. Also, I pointed out the fact as to the meds she's on, also that she may have gone to the next step in the ALZ, given grief. But I realize in my sister's case her ongoing need to be codependent, and definitely she gets paranoid when she feels she's losing control of a situation.

In general, after having read some recent posts, it would be good for several of us to read about this. We can't be responsible for people's emotional happiness, hopefully we can be for our own.
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I am thinking of temporarily moving away from this town so that I don't have to take care of Mom and get yelled at. But it is so costly to move away. I got to apologize that I am not supportive of you guys. I have a lot on my plate. I do read the posts. Hope you find your purse Burned. And yes I am co-dep.
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Izzy, ((((((hugs))))) time to say "No!" It will help to relieve the anger and resentment you feel. No one can look after any one else's emotional needs - no one can make anyone else happy. It is your mum's narcissism which expects you to do this. It is your choice whether to try to or not. Everyone is responsible for their own happiness.

cattails - I am glad you are coming to terms with your sister. I am too and life is better for that. We each have our own time lines as to when we can do this.

burned - prayers for finding your wallet. Losing important stuff is so frustrating.

A little word about codependency for everyone - something we can so easily get drawn into in caregiving, especially a narcissist.

This definition is from Wikipedia:
Codependency (or codependence, co-narcissism or inverted narcissism) is unhealthy love and a tendency to behave in overly passive or excessively caretaking ways that harm one's relationships and quality of life. It also often involves placing a lower priority on one's own needs, while being excessively preoccupied with the needs of others.[1] Codependency can occur in any type of relationship, including family, work, friendship, and also romantic, peer or community relationships.[1] Codependency may also be characterized by denial, low self-esteem, excessive compliance, or control patterns.[1] Narcissists are considered to be natural magnets for the codependent.

I quote this because I have BTDT, got the t-shirt and am not going back. It is a terrible place to be, but possible to get out of, though it does not seem so at the time. In a dysfunctional family, some are groomed to becoming codependent, to meet the needs of others. Melodie Beattie has some good books on that subject - one being "Codependent No More: How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself".

Yes, strangely enough, being codependent is controlling behaviour.

A quote of hers from another book “I used to spend so much time reacting and responding to everyone else that my life had no direction. Other people's lives, problems, and wants set the course for my life. Once I realized it was okay for me to think about and identify what I wanted, remarkable things began to take place in my life.”

Another quote from Robert Burney (Joy2MeU) - "Some of us (classic codependent behavior) tried to control through people pleasing, being a chameleon, wearing a mask, dancing to other people's tunes..."

I see a lot of codependent relationships on this site. Prayers for release from these bondages.
jo
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cattails you are so right.. we need just let go of being angry at these family members that are so very selfish.. Like you I do know that my sisters have issues as to why they cannot physically help me with my mom.. but emotional support would be also welcome.. They could call and talk to her.. She gets lonely and I get so tired of being her everything.. I would welcome any type of a break even her to ramble all the daily drama to one of them on the phone.. But even that they want no part of.. But my mom will call them and act like a completely different person with them on the phone.. she shows them none of the actions I get.. That is when I get so pissed.. They have a "short and sweet" type of conversation.. and when I over hear her hang up with an "I Love You", I think are you kidding me??.. It feels like a slap in the face..

Arrangements are being made for my son to go to mayo.. and this will be a week (or more) trip.. so it looks like I have to take my mom with.. Im not looking forward to this.. hopefully the hotel will be close because I will spend the day going from mayo to the hotel.. back and forth..

There are times I feel somewhat guilty for even feeling this way, and yet I dont even know what Im feeling.. is it resentment.. is it anger?? I dont know.. But I do know when my mom was my age she had her life.. she worked..she went out with friends.. she ran her house as she wanted..she never had to "take care" of anyone but her favorite daughter (and it wasn't me).. And my life now is completely opposite.. everything I do I have to consider her..her health issues..her feelings.. even things in my home are now so different then the way I like them to be..she will say "Is it ok if I move this here or put that there".. and she knows I would never say no.. I so often think "you had your time..this is mine".. Im sure this is an extremely selfish thought for me to even have.. right?? .. I miss the days when it was just me and my family.. especially now that my son needs me I find myself feeling these feelings even stronger.. I cant make her life over now and yet I feel it is up to me to not only care for her health needs but also her emotional needs.. Ive tried to find her hobbies.. well she likes nothing but planting flowers and Ive tried to tell her that she needs to accept that her life has changed now she can no longer be out in the heat planting flowers.. That is when an arguement starts.. she will not accept she is 83 with health issues.. Even her Dr. tried to explain this to her.. She is now looking for a different Dr.. This is when she reminds me of a "spoiled bratty child"..

My prayers are with us all today and everyday..
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Burned: How is your husband doing?
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Burned: By the way, did you ever check into volunteer hospice?
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Burned, I am praying that you find your wallet and that your little girl gets over her ear infection. It would be nice if our families would be there for us, but if they won't then we need to accept that they are lacking and we can't change that.

My sister was supposed to be here during the holidays to see my dad and give me a break. She never came and she never told me she wasn't able too. She just chose not to talk about it. Then she said she would be here during Spring break, she has the week off as she works for the school system. I talked to her today, Spring break starts Monday and she isn't coming. She didn't tell me she isn't coming, but I know she isn't. I could get angry with her, but she has little money and she loves to avoid the fact that she doesn't come through.

I've started taking a depression medication that is really good for anxiety. It helps me to not rip my sister's face off. It is what it is, Burned. It may not be fair, but it's reality and I can't change it. So, I am trying to take care of myself and give my dad the best care I can. That's all I can do. Love and Hugs to you, Cattails.
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well I need prayers n success in locating my wallet and of all places it disappeared at the house somewhere and i am hoping i didn't trash it. LOL least hope not... as for talking too much ...i thought it didnt matter what we said as long as we support one another even if we dislike certain dramas. So ill just ignore the statment that I talk to much when it should be I type too much lol. Right now my daughter has ear infection among others a very disturbing issue my wallet being missed so il stop since rambling and needs to be limited and ty Izzie ..put the shoe down and if ur ready walk away in my current position I cannot but i feel the fact we get no support from the ones that are suppose to be there instead find ways to take advantage of our situations instead of being a shoulder to cry on or giving us a break..
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Izzie, I am not a religious person but I have some experience from my own childhood traumas. Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong on this issue. Didn't Jesus say to turn the other cheek 77x7? I understand that to mean there is a limit and then you revert to Old Testament ways of dealing with people. In your case I think the time has come to revert to Old Testament. You have such a great heart full of love but please don't let others use your goodness for their selfishness and use you up. I don't know what state you live in, here in California medical will pay for long term nursing care. If your mother has money invested in stocks, bonds, etc. that money would have to be used first. If she owns a house, the money from the sale would have to be given to medical to pay them back unless your mother has an estate set up with an attorney who has set up her assets in such a way that the state can not get any money when she passes. From what you have posted, I understand that your mother has nothing but her SSI. I know you are against placing her in a NH, but I hope your reasons for not placing her is based on guilt. There are many good NH's available. You can visit her and still advocate for her needs. You are only human which means, you can only do so much. I believe you are truly a good soul who wants to please others at the expense of your own needs. Having needs does not make you selfish, it just means you are human. Jesus understands you have limits.
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Izabella I am so sorry for the way your Mom hurts you with her mean words-I know what that is like but at least I can control how often I see my mother. As long as she does not have blood sugar concerns and takes insulin missing meals will not hurt her. I am glad you told her her behaivor was like a spoiled child-I am hoping for a good night's sleep-I can not remember if you have siblings to take her from time to time.
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I had to take a minute from this day and come to the only place I can release.. Today was a very stressful day.. and I do feel so mentally drained.. My son is extremely depressed today.. and I wish so badly I could wave a wand and make him well but all I can do is be there for him everyday all day.. and that just doesnt seem like enough.. he cannot drive and I wish I could take him out for the day and get his mind off of being sick if only for a bit.. but i cannot do this because I also have to be here for my mom.. so fustrating trying to be there for everyones individual needs and they are so very different..

Today I had to go grocery shopping.. and when ever I leave the house I only have a limited time so Im not gone incase something happens.. Today my mom wanted to come with me.. she is now on oxygen pretty much all day..especially upon activity.. well Im waiting for a smaller oxygen unit to be delivered so she can go out.. the one she has now is pretty heavy and Im not suppose to lift that amount of weight due to my recent surgery.. I did have to carry it the other day for her dr appt and I sure felt it by evening.. Well, she says I am jailing her.. and I need to grow up ect.. just very hurtful words.. she is now refusing to eat the dinner I made.. just like a spoiled child.. and I told her that.. I just needed to vent.. I am just waiting to get through this day and go to bed..

Thank you for the warm words and hugs from my sources of strength on here.. I appreciate it so very much.. I mean that.. hugs back to you guys..
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Izzy, I am just catching up on reading all the posts, and now I am so crying for you, again!....while I agree with cattails 100%, I know you would never use a 2 x 4, literally....You need to do it figuratively....knock some sense into your family..Somehow....They are sucking the life out of you....your ONLY life!....What will they do if you are gone???...believe me, they will find a way....contrary to everyone's belief...you are not super woman, and you need to realize that....I do not think there is another person here on AC that is having a tougher time than you...I sincerely hope and, yes, pray, that God stops "dumping" on you as you say!....I'll even pray to send it more my way...

I'm not really up on all the medicaid rules, but I do know there are ways to "work" the system....ways to make it so your mom qualifies....Can someone on AC help here???....

You are VERY SPECIAL person and I am hoping with all my heart that the people you need to recognize that, finally do!!!
((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((HUGS!!!!!!))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
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Izzy: I only have a minute as I've got to get my dad up and get his breakfast. I just wanted to jot you a quick note to say that I don't think you are whining about things and I don't think you and Burned are a lot alike. I do, however, see how you can relate to Burned being up against the wall and not getting any support from family members.

I'm so sorry for all that you are going through. It just breaks my heart.
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Cattails.. You are very insightful and very honest.. and one thing about me I do appreciate honesty.. I am better to others then to myself.. I complain about being treated like crap and yet go back for more.. I am a complete peacemaker even if it is making peace by pushing the issues under the rug.. And I know my mom molded and trained me to be this way.. Ive mentioned in previous posts I am the youngest and when my horrible sisters hurt my mom I was her partner from a very young age.. helping her over it and all while doing that she expected me to help my sisters too.. I had to help them out of the mess they made.. My mom always told me you are stronger and wiser then they are..

Havin said all that.. I know I need to break a cycle of being to nice... and Im trying now by not answering my phone.. I really wish I had other options for my mom.. I have looked into everything.. She is very needy and she cannot be left alone because Im sure she has the early stages of demetia.. For me.. a NH is not an option.. a assisted living type facility would be wonderful..but she does not qualify for medicaid and her monthly SS is not enough for assisted living.. Ive looked into senior day care programs.. there are none where we live.. I keep hitting a brick wall for any help..

And you are so right.. Burned and I are alot alike.. as I said to her.. I think we both keep hoping our family members would step in and just say anything.. even give us an hr break.. so we keep hangin on to a unrealistic dream.. for me life has been hard but it always seemed God would give me one huge problem at a time.. this past yr he has just dumped one thing after another.. I had my mom move in first.. a week later my mastectomy.. then my son got so sick.. then my other sons asthma got very bad.. then my one sister was placed into a NH .. and my mom wants me to go to the NH to care for my sister there.. bring her stuff ect.. I handle everything for that sister.. talk to her Dr.'s ect..

So Im not making excuses..or whining about things I can change.. I have truly searched for answers of any kind.. for help of any kind.. sometimes we are just stuck.. so we come here.. because here is the only place that we can come and be ourselves..no one here expects us to be strong all the time..
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Izzy, your decision not to answer the phone calls is a wise one. Setting boundaries with difficult family members is necessary for our well being. I don't know the situation regarding your mother's health and if placing her in adult day care would help you to have more time to help your son. You are doing such a wonderful thing for your family members who need assistance and only you can know when is the time to place your mother in a NH. Continue to keep the boundaries in place regarding other family members as it will strengthen you more as time goes by. Take care of yourself as well and keep us posted on how things are going for you! ♥
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Izzy: I can't believe that you have a husband and children and a mom....all of them expecting you to make their lives better and no one understanding your heart and needs. You are a loving person. Maybe you need to get a 2 x 4 and start smacking some foreheads. Better yet, put your mom in a NH and find a nice quiet apartment for you. Change your cell phone number. Take care of the son that needs you and let the rest go. Here is the difference between you and Burned. You don't say anything and Burned says too much. I know I am going to get hate mail for this, but it's true. Burned rails on and on about her family. In her defense, she comes from a very dysfunctional family and she is young and doing the best she can for her husband and children. But she is wasting her time trying to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. So are you.

I read the post where you talked about doing laundry and then just broke down crying because of your son's situation. You are the only person in that house with a heart worth keeping. Maybe you can't support yourself and so you don't feel like you can make a move, but you need too.

Honey, your life is calling you. You know who is important and who is just draining you. I realize that their are financial consequences to placing your mom. I can only hope that she would qualify for medicaid.

Izzy, you are a precious star. Don't latch on to behavior that you can relate to, latch on to something better.

I have read many posts on this website, but you are in the top 10 of those who are so good and pure. Stop being so good and pure. Take care of your young son and you. To hell with the rest. My heartfelt love and prayers are with you.
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I am glad for this thread. Just found it today. My Dad is soon to be 86 in Late stage Dementia. I struggle with two sisters who want to make decisions based on their needs and not on his needs. One sister wanted to place him in an assisted living facility rather than a Facility with a memory unit where he has done some respite, Because the Assisted Liv. Facility was 3 minutes from her home but an hour away from everyone else because she was tired of driving out to his house. I Have a therapist that I have worked with on and off and she has been with me through several transitions. It is a safe place to sort things out. I am my dad's primary caregiver but not POA or finances although I do all of those things when it is inconvenient for my sisters. I Stay focused on what is best for my Dad and what do I need to do for Me. Thanks again for this thread
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Burned-- I have to say my heart truly goes out to you.. I really never knew in all the time Ive been coming to this group for so much support (THANK YOU ALL!!) The real situation with your husband.. I always said to myself "that I wish you would just tell that SIL of yours off" haha.. Seriously.. you need support from family..not added stress over a dress or anything else.. and its so unfair for them to put you through that now.. I also have a family that is selfish and only thinks about their feelings and their needs.. I have now gotten to a point where I do not even take their calls.. because I know it will just bring me upset and stress.. and really we have as you said enough on our plate to deal with their drama.. When my son was in the hospital last week and my mom was at home, I was running back and forth to care for both plus I have another son.. and if my phone rang and it was "family" I was hoping so bad they were calling to offer some type of help,or even support.. but that was not the case.. they were calling about something for them.. so now I dont pick up.. You see I truly do know the feeling of being so pissed at family you just wanna shake them and say.. "Dont you see what Im going through everyday?".. Dont put more stress on yourself burned.. you dont deserve it.. and karma is a wonderful thing.. they will see one day that all you really wanted was one of their phone calls to be about helping or being their for you and your family.. I also have no break with the care of my mom and now that my son needs me so much with his health issues I feel as you do torn.. Your husband needs you as do your children... so more stress is the last thing you need.. perfect line.. "you are not a secretary!!".. I have found a type of release for all the resentment I have towards my sisters.. Is I write it all in a journal.. as if I was telling them without the screaming match.. It helps get it off my chest and just throw it away so to speak.. between that and coming here.. it saves me from loosin it all together.. God Bless you and yours.. Izzy
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Thanks to everyone,this group is great!! Sometimes it is hard to just get over something Christy (burned). The harder it is to get our minds around an issue and the disappointment of the behavior of a family member, the longer it can take to come to terms with the situation. @ emjo, thank you for sound advice. Saying something neutral is best. My sister and I are on talking terms with our mother again after 2 months of mom's accusations. I am hoping my mom grew out of the situation as my sis and I held our ground and wouldn't let her manipulate us with comments like "I want to die." I just tell my mom when she talks like that, "You sound like a 12 year old girl." @ Ucantcare2much, so happy your MIL is doing better. It takes a lot off our shoulders when our loved ones are well and the worry is not weighing us down while we take care of them. Enjoy the weekend everyone!
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Burned: It sounds like your husband could qualify for Hospice care. It's not about a nurse coming in once a week. Often Hospice can provide you with free respite care and that is something you could sure use. There are two types of Hospice. One is covered by Medicare and the care is provided at the Hospice facility. That is not the one you would want to be involved with at this time. The other type of Hospice care is non-profit. They provide trained nurses and many well trained volunteers. They do not take medicare and therefore are not bound to such rigid guidelines. Everything they do is free to the patient and their families.

My father lives with us and he qualified for Hospice (the local non-profit type). He would not have qualified for a Medicare funded Hospice facility because they require that the doctor state that the patient have 6 months or less to live. That is not the case with the non-profit, volunteer Hospice.

My father's doctor made a referral to the non-profit Hospice for my dad and they accepted him. Now, my dad could live another year or more or he could be gone next week. That made no difference to them and he was accepted into their program. They can be very helpful in providing equipment that you might need. They are there to support you just as much as they are there to help your husband. Often, they have a working relationship with some care giving groups and can provide you with someone to come in and do the bathing at no charge or just stay for a couple of hours to give you a break. Sometimes they have volunteers who will come in and let you have a break. They are very kind people and will not bombard you with things you don't need.

Talk to you husband's doc and see if he/she will make a referral for you. Then you can talk to the Hospice people and see if it's something that works for you.
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Sorry, I did not read the latest in the thread.
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Anyone heard from Izabella lately?
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We are still waiting for the cardiologist to confirm his condition and he has CHF besides empeyma and epilepsy and copd some contracture due to not enough calicium but he made it through another year ..more concerned with his emotional and mental state of mind...so far i haven't need a wkly visit from a nurse or anything like but it hurts the children to see him this way especially our oldest and alll his insurance would end up going to nursing home which I am not gonna do unless he requires much more than what I can. He can go for another couple more yrs or be gone by summer but he is tough n ornery. He is hanging on I think because he doesn't think i can handle single motherhood when in essence been doing that for a long time. I give him the best attention and answer his needs as best as I can but sometimes with day to day stuff its not enough. I cannot get a respite break unless i put him in NH they told me that so its not happening. I am still trying to get him to the pulmonologist and neurologist he keeps fighting on me on that and i keep fighting back...mostly he feels he has let everyone down and I let him know that is not the case; you have been doing what ya can but now you see how important is for me to be there for you instead of burdening yourself. Sometimes that works but what is mess up none of his family calls to see how he is doing and none of mine call either and I refuse to be the family secretary because i have too much on my plate as it is. So if i get offended I will let ya know but normally i just ignore some things being said ...we cannot help families only ourselves granted if we do not want to release on the one we love we need to release where its safe.
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Burned: You can give your daughter a wedding dress that comes from your heart and your love for her. It doesn't have to be the one your mom made. It can be store bought or hand made by you. It doesn't matter. All that matters is that she knows how much you love her. You say you and your mom have some estrangement. Why bring any of that to your daughters wedding, ie the dress. You can make your own traditions and give your personal love to your daughter in so many meaningful ways. I know it's hard for you, but try to let the dress go. You and your love for your children are enough, you don't need the dress.

May I ask what is your husband's prognosis? In past things you have written, it sounds like his time is limited, but I'm not sure if I understood that correctly. I'm wondering if Hospice is an option for you.

You don't owe me an apology. Having said that, I will be honest with you. I will, however, make a point of not being so hard nosed about it.
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