The Caregiver & Dysfunctional Families: How are you doing?

Amen!! And I am proud of you!

thanks banshee, I know, and my sis and I are not at all alike. I feel badly for how she treats her son and family. I know it is out of my control. He and his family and I are developing a very nice relationship. Now, she us trying to stir up trouble between mother and me over mother's 100th b'day ceklebration. Not going to happen, I am not taking the bait. Mother can stir up enough trouble without any help from her lol.
Ah, a little simplicity would be nice...

CMag Prayers for wife, please write when you can and know our hearts are with you.

emjo Gentle nudge...you are not your sister, her actions and inactions are out of your control. Love your nephew with all your heart (he is a lucky man) and goodness will reign. We should all be so blessed to have you for an auntie. XO

burned (((((hugs)))) - I agree totally with the others and that detachment is the best place to be with that family of yours and his
Isn't it wonderful when we fully realize that it is not our job to fix anyone - that's letting go of the codependency and becoming healthy
banshee - I am glad for you that your mum is in LTC and that you choose not to visit when she turns ugly - it is very important to remember that "she can't hurt me anymore unless I make myself available" - so much wisdom in that, I am learning to make myself less available too
austin - so glad you got to that point too - let go and let God.
cmag - thanks for your research - we have so much to learn, hope your wife's carpal tunnel surgery goes well today
jessie - are u back on the detachment wagon?
today I am sad as I have been in contact with my nephew - my sister is narcissistic too, and more vicious/heartless than my mum, I have slowly been developing a relationship with my nephew and family, who are a long distance away, but email works. He is estranged from his mum and she has disinherited him (long story). They have the most beautiful little boy, her only grandchild and she pays no attention to him. This morning he wrote and told me some things my sis had said to his wife when she was 2 weeks post partum, and I am shocked and saddened and my resolve to visit them one day is increased. Today, I am ashamed of my family and their behaviour.

Austin You are too good to be true!!! I love you for sharing that you apologized to GOD for your husband. Sh-h I hear your angel wings flapping. Love, love, love to you for putting this smile on my face.

That is a very good point it is not your job to fix others -what a relief it was to realize it was not my job to make my husband happier when all he wanted to do was fuss and fight-I even told God I feel bad it's his problem now and apoligzed for my husbands behaivor in heaven-maybe he has learned his lessons by now.

Burned You are doing the very best you can with what you have available, you are a fighter, and I can tell you love your family very much. I know it sounds glib, but look after your own and anyone who isn't validating you...let them go! Is there a patient's advocate that could assist with your sweetheart? When it comes to relative's wanting more...I would turn off the phone, the lights, and lock your door!! You are doing all you can and then some. It is not your job to fix everyone else. Do at least one nice thing for yourself today OK?

sballen My soul is sending yours all the love and support of the universe. It is frightening (or it is for me) when my mom does these things too. And going home? She may be further into dementia than has been diagnosed. I can tell you that I LOVE that she is in LTC. They are trained to care for her and when she turns ugly I can choose to not visit or answer my phone. It is a hard change to make, but my fear & anxiety levels drop daily, just knowing she can't hurt me anymore unless I make myself available. I wish I could pick you up and go "home hunting" with you. Do you have a friend that could help you with this?

((((((((sballen))))))) - so sorry you are going through this - it sounds like your mum has taken a (big?) step downhill
hope your hand is OK and that you get through to the doc and get some help quickly
maybe time to tour those ALFs,
Let us know how it goes more ((((((hugs))))))

sballen, this sounds so frightening. Please let us know how things are. Is your hand okay? We are here for you, honey.

Morning Everyone,
Well, mom had a meltdown this morning. This was my first time witnessing it. She pushed me out of her room(literally), demanded to go home immediately (lives 3 hours away), and slammed a briefcase on my hand. She became completely irrational...Stage3???
I have a call to her doctor but had to vent first. I'm still shaking.

I hate to say it but I am woefully and complete detached except my family. I can communicate to my parents fine and but I cannot bring myself to communicate to his side of the family. They have done and said cruel things behind my back and yet I am suppose to take care of his sister and him at the same time. I am sorry I cannot do that...If i had a bigger place and more money I would but I do not; its difficult to save money and still look for another job. Yes I am still looking and right now I have to accept the peanuts I am making until hubby gets worse tho case manager has said NH and he doesnt want to do that. I can fully understand that but I am tired, depressed and feeling angry or locked away. Sometimes I feel as tho I am empty of emotion yet still have the context to feel and do but I am will not respond to the aid of a family that has barely responded to the aid of my husband whose their brother..and this laugh his nephew is supposedly coming to live in Ajo, I wonder if its a communal plan to plant a spy in my midst or something like that...I hope it takes him a good awhile before he gets here...and that his family keeps him too busy as it is to see his uncle God allowing should he want that. I know we all been thru something and terrible losses but its the fact that we fight to get rid of the chip from the burdens we feel yet this situation is not a burden its one of love and faithful. ALL I can say is THANK GOD and btw someone passes judgement on u because ur the only one doing it then they have no say in it anymore. YOu are doing what they refuse to do and in the end expect something. we do rock and we are the rock that is only left in other lives and therefore have to become their angels even if its bittersweet but its done with the best of good intentions and actual love that is compassion which the world sorely lacks..

Amen,. austin! she will will continue to out up barriers.
(((((((Jessie)))))) just catching up with your posts now
Sorry you fell off the detachment wagon – (but, like that phrase). Sometimes everything you do is the wrong thing BTDT, Glad you have the rabbits to cuddle. Pets are wonderful companions.
Also glad one sil is supportive. Hope you can ignore the other one. You are absolutely right, if Jesus were there he would sit and hold dad’s hand. What a gift that OT is!
Caregivers do rock, and do go through a lot!
Jessie, I am glad you went to the DONM site. It has so much good information and many suggestions. Your mum’s reactions do sound narcissistic.. Narcissists always stir up the waters and create problems- - doesn’t matter what it is about, or if it makes no sense to you.
There are several theories about the cause of personality disorders such as narcissism, but none of these are really clear. Here is a quote from the Mayo Clinic about causes, which includes pretty well everything I have read.
“It's not known what causes narcissistic personality disorder. As with other mental disorders, the cause is likely complex. The cause may be linked to a dysfunctional childhood, such as excessive pampering, extremely high expectations, abuse or neglect. It's also possible that genetics or psychobiology — the connection between the brain and behavior and thinking — plays a role in the development of narcissistic personality disorder.”
In my mother’s extended family there were several women, and one man that I know of, who were “strange” and self centered. Mother is one of them. Her 4 siblings (now deceased) were the nicest people you could meet, as were my grandfather and grandmother. This leads me to suspect a genetic connection in her case, and the others in her family. There was no abuse, or neglect or pampering.
Madge – ((((hugs))))). I sure hope your mum does not take you up on that offer. Her nursing home suggestion sounds good to me. Hold her to it, if you need to! Yes, the chickens do come home to roost. Good to see you posting

I agree take the tours with or without her and narrow it down -her options are ALF #1 or 2 -she can see them with or without her headache if she will not tour them -you pick the one that is easist for you-she will continue to set up barriaers until the cows come home or maybe her choice will be ALF or NH-she will never run out of excuses.

Oh yes, the medication is necessary. There're 2 different blood pressure meds (Norvasc & Aldactone), low dose aspirin, Aricept (for memory), and eye drops for glaucoma. When she doesn't take her meds the blood pressure goes high and she starts having hallucinations. She has stage 2 dementia but is still able to feed, dress, and bathe herself. Sound mind?? :)

(((((hugs))))) sballen I hear you say you are so very tired, and I do believe you have to look after yourself, so my first thought is that one way or another you need a break. Coingratulations on keeping your mum on a routine despite her reluctance. Yes, control is the name of the game.
Can you get a third party opinion - doctor or social worker or some such person invloved as to the wisdom of her going back to her house? Has she had an evaluation to assess her capabilities, and what level of home care she needs, or if, indeed, it is advisable forn nher to go home?Have you toured the facilites yourself so as to narrow down the search? I would be inclined to go on the tour without her, to show her that you are serious about this option. making it clear to her that one day it may be her only option, and if you were her you would like to be involved in the choice.If she is capable of going home with home care, it may not work out that well because of the narcissism and control issues, however it is fair enough to try it, if it works for you. You may be fortunate enough to get care workers who can handle narcissists.
How about - Plan A - she goes home with Home Care (as long as her eval indicates this is OK) and if that does not work out, Plan B is an ALF. I would make it clear to her what her options are.
Let her know clearly also, in writing if necessary, what you can do for her and what you cannot do for her, or she will likely chip away at your time and energy. Using cmag's phrase -they hoover you in.
I know all these things are hard, and I pray that you work out a solution that is good for you and that takes care of your mum's needs.
Let us know what happens.
jo

what a difficult question. I can only assume your Mom is of reasonably sound mind, not forgetful; well, any more than the rest of us. I don't know. people like their independence. here's one I do know about, in spite of not being a licensed quack.
what med's is she taking? and are they necessary? as in really necessary? she's from a different generation when the quacks and so called "health insurance" SWINE didn't want to force all of us into being patients by lowering the numbers gradually over the years. blood pressure, cholesterol, etc...maybe she doesn't think she needs some of that crap. if you tell me what some of it is, I'll give you my layman's opinion.

OK, need some help here...mom is very unhappy living with us because she can't have ALL of the control. We make her take her medications, remind her to stay hydrated, eat 2-3 healthy meals daily, etc. But she wants to move back to her house (3 hours from us) and have Home Care.Part of me is ready to pack her bags while the other part knows she will probably end up coming back here in a few months. We've explained that we won't be able to run back and forth to her house everytime the house needs repair nor can she expect the neighbors to keep an eye on her. I've contacted the ALFs in our area, got the brochures, ready to take tours but each time the convenient "headache" appears. We're trying to do what's best for her and us but she just wants to have her way...CONTROL
Open for thoughts and suggestions. I'm so tired!!!

Cmag thank you for taking the time to post the above-it is very helpful.

Earlier today, I promised to post some information on detachment.

This is clipped from coping*dot*org (Tools for dealing with control issues/learning how to detach).

In order to become detached from a person, place, or thing you need to:..:

First: Establish emotional boundaries between you and the person, place, or thing with whom you have become overly enmeshed or codependent on.

Second: Take back power over your feelings from persons, places, or things which in the past you have given power to affect your emotional well-being.

Third: "Hand over'' to your Higher Power the persons, places, and things which you would like to see changed but which you cannot change on your own.

Fourth: Make a commitment to your personal recovery and self-health by admitting to yourself and your Higher Power that there is only one person you can change and that is yourself and that for your serenity you need to let go of the "need'' to fix, change, rescue, or heal other persons, places, and things.

Fifth: Recognize that it is "sick'' and "unhealthy'' to believe that you have the power or control enough to fix, correct, change, heal, or rescue another person, place, or thing if they do not want to get better nor see a need to change.

Sixth: Recognize that you need to be healthy yourself and be "squeaky clean'' and a "role model'' of health in order for another to recognize that there is something ``wrong'' with them that needs changing.

Seventh: Continue to own your feelings as your responsibility and not blame others for the way you feel.

Eighth: Accept personal responsibility for your own unhealthy actions, feelings, and thinking and cease looking for the persons, places, or things you can blame for your unhealthiness.

Ninth: Accept that addicted fixing, rescuing, enabling are ``sick'' behaviors and strive to extinguish these behaviors in your relationship to persons, places, and things.

Tenth: Accept that many people, places, and things in your past and current life are "irrational,'' "unhealthy,'' and "toxic'' influences in your life, label them honestly for what they truly are, and stop minimizing their negative impact in your life.

Eleventh: Reduce the impact of guilt and other irrational beliefs which impede your ability to develop detachment in your life.

Twelfth: Practice "letting go'' of the need to correct, fix, or make better the persons, places and things in life over which you have no control or power to change.

Personally, in place of the phrase "your higher power", I put God. I hope this list is helpful.

There are two more things that I want to add that I did not write. These have more to do with relating with someone who has borderline personality disorder, but they are useful elsewhere.

(SET)Support - Empathy - Truth

Support refers to an initial statement, which indicates the loved one supports the person. It is a statement that begins with "I" and demonstrates concern and a desire to help. It can be anything that establishes a foundation for the relationship or interaction: "I want to try to help you feel better," "I care about you," or "I am worried about how you are feeling."

The support statement is meant to reassure the person that the relationship is a safe one, and that his/her needs matter even during this difficult moment.

Empathy refers to communicating that the loved one is trying to understand what the person is feeling, and focuses on "you." It is not a conveyance of pity or sympathy, but instead a true awareness and validation of the feelings of the BP: "I see you are angry, and I understand how you can get mad at me," "How frustrating this must be for you."

It is important not to tell the person how he is feeling, but instead put his demonstrated feelings into words. The goal is to convey a clear understanding of the uncomfortable feelings he is having and that they are OK to have, thus validating his feelings. Without such a statement of empathy, the person may feel that his feelings are not understood. It is important to use feeling words, as in the examples above.

Truth refers to a realistic and honest assessment of the situation and the person's role in solving the problem. It is an objective statement that focuses on the "it" -- not on the subjective experience of the person or yourself. Often the person may seem to be asking, or demanding, something impossible, not taking an active role or responsibility in resolving the issue, or even presenting you with a "no-win" situation. The truth statement is meant to clearly and honestly respond to the difficult demand or behavior of the person, while placing responsibility appropriately: "This is what I can do.," "This is what will happen.," "Remember when this happened before and how you felt so bad about it later."

It is important to use the support and empathy statements first, so that the person is better able to hear what you are saying, otherwise the truth statement may be experienced as little more than another, and expected, rejection creating even more defensiveness or anger.

------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
PUVAS
(use for complaining and/or blaming)

- Pay attention
- Understand fully
- Validate emotions
- Assert yourself
- Shift/Share the Responsibility

Paying attention to what is happening and what is being said helps us avoid making assumptions.

Understanding what someone is trying to communicate may require seeking clarification so we don't make assumptions.

Validating the emotional statements of the other person will pave the way for further smooth communications.

Asserting yourself is a form of setting boundaries and is a very important piece of the healthy communication process.

Shifting responsibility where it belongs holds each party accountable for their own feelings and behaviors. This can be in response to four different scenarios...

1.) If your person is blaming you for his or her feelings and behaviors
2.) If you are placing blame on yourself inappropriately
3.) If you are trying to fix their problem
4.) If you recognize that you have done something to contribute to the problem.

Sometimes narcississm is caused by spoiling and over indulging. Mom has some of that and then her parents divorced. She was always from that day forward "poor pitiful me". Uses it as an excuse to not do something for people. Just had a conversation with her today. I told her she was always welcomed to come live with me in Florida if she so decided. Just wanted her to know she has more than one child (my brother is king). She told me thank you, but I will go to a nursing home when and if I need it. She said because she knows how hard it is to care for a elderly parent. Please, her Dad had a heart attack and died, and her Mom had cancer and her Mom's husband cared for her. Mom did almost nothing.
But I am glad she made that statement since I really don't want to deal with her. The chickens will come home to roost.

I just went on the DONM site and was shocked. Except for personal appearance, my mother fit each characteristic. My mother has never cared how she dressed or looked. I used to be ashamed of the awful way she looked when I was young. But somehow I figured out when I was young that she didn't love her husband and children.

So much written is true of my mother. She loves it when others fail and ignores when they succeed. She used to use bad things we did as teenagers to go out and gossip with the neighbors about "ain't it awful."

It is sad that she has gone through a life of not loving. I wonder what could have caused it in her. Her father and mother were both warm, caring people. I knew that my mother had many narcissistic traits, but didn't know she fit into the narcissistic mother category. I guess because she has always looked so awful.

I fell off the detachment wagon this week and got sucked into whirlpool of emotion. My father is having home health come in. He doesn't like being around people, so he has been in his doomed mood. My mother has been confused. I have been trying to navigate, but no matter what I do, it is the wrong thing. I've been reaching to pull myself out of the whirlpool, but I keep getting pulled back in. Right now I'm hiding in my room, drinking a warm cup of strong coffee, and enjoying being with my rabbits. Rabbits have great healing properties. When the world turns crazy, all one has to do is pet a rabbit and feel better. They are magic like that.

I emailed the families of my two brothers and got responses from my SILs. One was supportive as always. She and my brother took care of her mother for many years before she died, so they know what I'm going through. My other SIL is very religious and sent back a very odd email about how all that was going on was to glorify God and to sanctify our souls, quoting scripture. Okay. Her email came across sounding judgmental and cold. I never say much to them, because I know we don't have a fun bunch of people in this house, but sometimes I want to say, "You talk the talk, but don't walk the walk." If Jesus was here, I know he would come and sit and hold my father's hand.

Yesterday my mother and father had not wanted to have OT & PT for my father anymore. So I cancelled the appointments. Then my mother got mad that Dad wasn't trying and said he was committing suicide. So one day she wants to cancel. Then we cancel and she flies into a rage. I wish I could say for sure it was dementia, but she isn't diagnosed. The OT showed up yesterday, anyway, and my father told her he did want to keep seeing her. She relates well to him -- she must be a treasure to do that! She took time and worked with him. I think she did a lot of good. She even made him show a spark of life. I knew that she had been sent to him because she was someone he needed. There are angels walking among us.

My mother didn't like her because she said the OT worked Dad too hard. I hope she doesn't poison that water. Today she started in on him about the income taxes. Goodness! I can do the taxes if I need to. I don't know why she is fretting him about them just now. He has had a trying week.

Something that occurred to me yesterday is that we caregivers go through a lot and keep going. Caregivers sure do rock! Proud to be one.

My mother woke up this morning in a very quiet mood. Actually, she was pouting because she wasn't getting her way about where we would go shopping today. After we had breakfast I realized she wasn't going to shower and dress at all. So, I showered, got dressed and went out by myself (was gone for only 20 minutes). Now she has a terrible headache and walks around the house talking about how lightheaded she feels. My punishment for going out without her. :) I gave her a Tylenol and suggested she lie down and rest. Since she's been in bed she's asked me to check her blood pressure, take her temperature, need a glass of juice and of course needed to go to the bathroom. I know it's a small issue but I'm recognizing the narcissistic control. Now I have a headache!!!

Izabelle ((((((hugs))))) wish we were closer too.
jessie has a great idea - use what ever the system will give you - it can't all be up to what your mum wants. You have needs too and big ones, You don't have to stay all night because she doesn't like the nurses - you NEED to take whatever time you can for yourself. My mother doesn't like the help she gest either, and would have me give up my life here with home, my sig other, my kids and grandkids to go and live with her and wait on her hand and foot. - and I know she would complain all the time. I can't do it - it would finish me one way or another. They don't like it, but other people can look after them - maybe even better than you can as they have detachment and training. If your mum has gone onto heart failure then I would think she may need different care than you can give her. And remember - no guilt. Talk to a social worker at the hospital, or the dept of aging care. or anyone who can help (I don't know the American system as I am in Canada) and tell them what you ared up against with your health and your son's health, and your mother. Know my prayers are still with you! Since she is already in hospital can they keep her to do all the tests?
cmag - I don't think anyone worries about your grammatical errors or even notices them - your input is so valuable. Looks like you have the financial things in order now - a good attny is necessary.
hi sballen51 and welcome - a narcissistic mum and all the negative energy is a very hard one to deal with. I am not an only child, but my sister is the golden girl ,and I am cinderella - to do the work and take the blame, I was shocked when my mum said she was coming to live near me as she got older, as my sister always expected mother to move near her. They used to holiday toigether -at my mother's expense. The distance had helped me, and a lot of cans of worms were opened when mother moved closer. I had to deal with them. I would never take her into my home (as long as there was ANY other alternative) as I knew she would take over my life. What I have found in the past 15+ years is that I have to work through the anger and hurt from the past, and grieve the mother I needed but never had, in order to detach and distance emotionally. Detaching is not easy, but was necessary for my mental and physical health, and it is what the experts recoimmend when dealing with a narcissist.
ucant -hope your head is better (((hugs)))
marirob - u r welcome. I learn more and more as I google various aspects of narcissism -there is more than one type of narcissists, but they do have some things in common, I know I need to heal from the past, and would rather do that before mother passes, as much as possible. It isn't always over when it is over. I am glad you can share with your sister. Mine is worse than my mother, so that is another closed door for me. You are soi right about the triggers, and getting dragged back down into the morass,
jessie, not all old people are in bad moods - my aunt who died at 97 was as sweet as ever right to the end, and I know others who were. I think you live as you have always lived and if that was negative, it probably gets worse as you get older - it surely is depressing What did you get your dad for Valentines Day?
austin - thanks for your input - it is always good to hear from someone who started to stick up for themselves - that message can't be stressed enough

Please all caregivers - do something good for YOU today. Your needs are equally important as the needs of others!.(at least) It is so easy to get into a codependent relationship with those you care for - BTDT got several T-shirts, not going back. Detachment is not easy, but can be a life saver in a situation with a narcissist.
If I have forgotten anyone, it is not intentional
Love, hugs and prayers for all ♥♥♥
jo


I thought i was getting a handle on first names for those of you who have shared them, but my brain isn't cooperating unless i see the name often

Izabella, is there anyway they can admit her into a NH and take advantage of the 100 day Medicare rehab allowance? It would be a godsend to you if there was a reason to admit her.

Joan.. what can I say that I havnt told you a million times before.. "thank you w/all m/heart".. I wish you were closer so I could give you a big hug in person..

My mom went by ambulance to the hospital yesterday.. I was there for most the night because she doesnt like any of the nurses.. I finally could not stay any longer due to I am still very sore from my surgery.. she went into heart failure.. plus her potassium is way off as are many other things, so they will balance her off and then she will come home to me to care for.. Im trying not to think of that part right now.. I mentioned to the Doc this morning on the phone about her confusion/her all around behavior.. and how it has gotten worse.. he is going to look into that.. I really dont want to think of this road I have ahead of me..

Why do we with a narcissistic parent put up with the verbal and psychological abuse that we would divorce such a spouse for. Because we were trained to and they planted those buttons in us for their emotional blackmail in us long ago so that they could continually hoover us into their drama using fear of making them mad, obligation to their needs alone, and guilt if we even have an idea, feeling or want a life or our own. Occasionally, we even end up with a spouse who is similar to the parent that we have the most difficulty with.

I will get the detachment info on here sometime today.

I think that I need to take the time to review my posts giving how many grammatical errors that I make from time to time. I'll just blame it on being a bit manic when I write these posts.

Good morning, sballen51. I'm glad that what I wrote was helpful.

Sometime today, I'm going to post some information somebody gave me about detachment.

Prayers, love and hug for you as well as for everyone else!

sballen, the negative energy is bad. Sometimes I want to just stay in bed in the morning. I'm in this wonderful little cocoon where all is happy. As soon as I get up, reality hits. Why are old people often in bad moods all the time? It's depressing. I've been stuck at home all week this week because of the home heath people and normal chores. I'm starting to go crazy with it.